32 thoughts on “Two Disconcerting Trends: Korean Kids, School Systems, and Parental Appraisal”

1. This is so insightful. Thanks for taking the time to write this.

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   1. Dear Kelsey,

      Thanks! I am hoping I can get around to the second part soon… if I can make time between all my lessons, and fiction-writing. I’ll add a comment to this post when it goes up, if you like? Presumably you signed up get notices for responses to your comment, right?

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2. I enjoyed your observations, and without getting too deep into it, I want to comment on a couple of your points. One is how Korean students therre seem to only react when theyre told to do something. Korea has always been under control by different powers up until recently, of course, you know about the Japanese annexation (not occupation) and the dictatorships of various leaders, who basically up until 15 years ago, gave up for a more democratic society. Every culture has a point its citizens strive for. For Americans, its “freedom” and “individuality,”generally. For Koreans, its power. and respect through position (like I said, I wont explain more, its a wormhole). They want to tell others what to do and not be told what to do, because they have to perform, Duty is the main driver. Theyre not taught they are individual citizens, but theyre parts of the group (the ubiquitous URI). Their social manners are taught in respect to this. Theyre taught to greet those above them, and use the respectful words, BUT generally, social manners are not really delve into, as they are concerned with themselves and their inner circles, they generally dont have regard for those outside of their groups or such, so it comes off as Socially Awkaward, in that, theyre not able to relate to other people very well ( thats the inverse result of people focusing inward). Theyre taught to not stick out too much and since they have a very small country and limited area to live, theyre always on top of each other, Because of their Confucian tradition, theyre taught there is a “correct way” to do things, but theres isnt a very specific way to do. Korean culture is very vague at best. After 13 years here, Im still not too sure EXACTLY what a Korean is supposed to be and do, but a lot of people here live that way.

   English and all foreign langauges are ways to communicate with others outside your sphere, but Korean culture is not about that at all, its the opposite. I always feel the number one problem for K-kids and K-peeps isn’t that they’re shy, its that the have these concepts of “Correct” and “Us.” Also, their nationalism works against them. If theyre the best, why should they learn another language? The Korean language is very strict and I feel quite unnatural in its modern sense (I speak Korean rather well). Korean langauge is about subservience, and the duty to the causes they have. IMO, English is much more expressive, because its a language for individual expression. English has ton of more expression than Korean does. Odd considering that, older Koreans use to brag about how many words Koreans had for colors, feelings, but in the end, not many people use those words now.

   One last thing, in Korea, being Obedient is considered good, because of the reasons said before. The words for smart and genius are used much more than clever, which really isnt the point. Modern Korean education is for the point of putting those managers in the Chaebol, so now, they need English, and I thank god for that, itll be a perpetual rolling ball of profit for the clever teachers. Because, theyre still not that good with English.

   Finally, I do very well in my classes for this reason. I bark at the kids, and I control their speech. The younger ones love to learn and sing songs, the older ones grunt a long, but Korea may have ended its dictatorship 15 years before, but itll be a dictatorship for a long long time. Smart people will take advantage of it. Korean society is already shrinking and depressed. Theres no way to fix that. Because in the end, they want these conditions for their society and education. Its a system thats always been there.

   I hope I made sense.

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   1. J-mac,

      I saw you reposted your comment. I wasn’t holding it back or anything, it’s just that all new commenters go into moderation as a spam-control measure, and I don’t always have time to check my blog everyday.

      I get the sense that some of your history is a bit off. For example: what’s the real difference between annexation and occupation? They’re not mutually exclusive states, and in fact, in the 19th and 20th century, annexation was really a legalistic shortcut to enable a more brutal form of occupation, as far as I’ve read. (And not just in Korea.) Also, the dictatorships officially ended more than 15 years ago. Hell, they’d been over more than a decade when I first arrived, more than a decade ago. While I think the CIA World Factbook is exaggerating when it calls Korea a “fully functioning modern democracy,” I’d say that about a lot of other places too.

      You’re about some things–like how differing fundamental values come into play, and the values especially relate to cultural norms–but I find a lot of the not-very-deep popular observations of the sort that pass for “fact” in the drinking houses of South Korea, but don’t hold up to more careful analysis. For example the claim that Koreans tend to believe in a “right way” to do things “because of Confucianism”: I hear stuff like that all the time, but never see any real evidence. To me, it’s a bit like blaming all American social problems on “excessive American individualism” when in fact Canadians are in a lot of ways just as individualistic… but have far fewer of certain social problems. Frankly, I’ve realized that a lot of what people–including many modern Koreans–attribute to Confucianism, is probably just as likely to be stuff internalized either during the Japanese occupations, and/or the dictatorships… and that a certain amount of what seems to us to be timelessly part of Korean culture is new developments traceable to the Asian Financial Crisis of 1997.

      For example: I think risk-aversion has probably long been a feature of all peasant societies, including the one that Korea was when it entered the Japanese occupation, though the added strictness of the Joseon Dynasty (which used Confucianism as a tool to achieve the added strictness) likely heightened that a little. Still, the occupation and dictatorship would have pushed risk-aversion to new heights: to stand out too much under a colonial occupation or a dictatorship with a ridiculously deep implementation of the Benthamite panopticon (ie. surveillance of civilians by fellow civilians, which was pervasive under Park and Chun) would be a very dangerous proposition. But I get the impression that in the 90s, Korean society really did start loosening up, trying to be a little less risk-averse. Unfortunately, it got hammered in ’97, and it seems like it’s in the shadow of that, that moms are force-feeding their kids hakwon English and hakwon math to a degree that goes far beyond the point of diminishing returns.

      (I’ll talk more about that in my next post on the subject.)

      As for the vagueness of Korean culture: well, hm. My wife is Korean, and she finds Korean culture pretty clear-cut–too clear-cut for her tastes. Her perception is that Koreans usually seem to have a pretty good idea what they’re expected to do, and that if they deviate from it, they get hammered by endless criticisms, inquires, and pressure. (When are you finishing university? When are you getting a “good” job? When are you getting married? When are you going to have children? When are you going to have a boy? When are you going to move into a nicer house? When are your kids going to finish university? When are your kids going to get a job?… and so it goes.) Vague for you doesn’t necessarily mean vague for Koreans. Overall, she wishes there were more allowance for broad interpretation of social expectations, or broader freedom to flount them.

      I will agree with you that the Korean language has a lot of hierarchy built into it explicitly, but you’re kidding me if you think that English doesn’t. It sounds as laughable the time when Korean professor I worked with once who was telling students that English has only ten words for colors, and that Korean was “superior” for describing things. I told them to look up azure, mauve, fuschia, taupe, emerald, jade… and then pointed out 99% of the time the word I heard people say in Korean was also the simplest. (빨간색, 초록색, etc.) I doubt that Korean is more expressive in English for you, but I have translator friends whom I have no doubt can use Korean just as expressively as I use English… and I’m a fiction writer. Indeed, you sound somewhat like those silly old-timers who brag that their language is the “superior” and the “more expressive” (or even “the most scientific”). I’m fundamentally discomfited by the explicit hierarchic address in Korean, but I think that has more to do with my own experience of power being misused by people speaking that language to me. (Ajeoshis pulling rank and saying, “How old are you?” in banmal when I disagreed with them, for example.) Had my personal experiences been more positive, I’d have ended up praising the way the language so easily allows one to be polite to those elders and superiors toward whom one is expected to extend extra politeness, unlike in English where one has to rely on much more vague and unclear linguistic cues to demonstrate politeness, respect, and so on.

      I will agree with you that nationalism, an extreme sense of “us” versus “them,” and heightened aversion to risk all inhibit language acquisition; I’d also argue that when I lived in Montreal–a few Francophone friends and relatives aside–I exhibited a fair number of those traits: I was scared to make a mistake; I was shy to talk to Francophones as imposing “others,” and I had a sense of being on “their” turf. (The nationalism that held me back in Quebec wasn’t Anglo nationalism, it was perceived Quebecois nationalism.) Which is to say those traits are pretty universal: rare is the language learner who doesn’t struggle with it. Koreans are notoriously harder to teach not because Korean culture makes people risk averse or gives an unprecedented sense of “us versus them” so much as because it enfranchises those unthinking reactions as normal and acceptable: it’s okay to be a rabid nationalist, to be risk averse to a degree that would be extreme in most of the Western world, and to be so focused on your in-group that your socially incapacitated with strangers.

      But this, I have issues with:

      One last thing, in Korea, being Obedient is considered good, because of the reasons said before. The words for smart and genius are used much more than clever, which really isnt the point. Modern Korean education is for the point of putting those managers in the Chaebol, so now, they need English, and I thank god for that, itll be a perpetual rolling ball of profit for the clever teachers. Because, theyre still not that good with English.

      See, I find that in Korea cleverness in practical terms, cleverness is much more valued than intelligence. People throw around words like smart and genius the way Americans throw around words like democracy and freedom; but the real value in American society is money, not abstract political values. (If Americans cared so much about freedom they’d long ago have recognized that massive economic inequalities don’t engender it. If Koreans truly valued intelligence, they’d collectively realize that gaming your way through a exam is a poor substitute for mastering a subject area.) The weird thing is the disconnect between the social conception of schooling and learning–where clever fakery is really the valued way, and the way plenty of moms expect their kids to get ahead–and the rhetoric, which privileges “hard work” and “long hours” and “dedication.”

      I think the real disconnect is between two cultural expectations in Korea: on the one hand, the child will be dutiful and obey his or her parents; and on the other hand, the child will excel in official examinations. The two together privilege one kind of kid: the kid who cynically pays lip service to mom and dad’s expectations, but games the system as much as possible–retiring to one’s room to play computer games when nobody is looking, and memorize-regurgitating, faking, or cheating one’s way through the academic system. In both cases, the kid who is actually “smart” in the sense of being both intellectually bright, and not given to bullshitting on everything, is going to be demotivated by the academic bullshit, frustrated by teachers expecting and doing the bare-minimum, frustrated by illogical parents whose ridiculous expectations are inherently self-contradictory when they aren’t just plain nonsensical.

      It’s those “smart” kids who get seen as troublemakers, as problem kids; the cynical bullshitters who cheat and fake are seen as “smart.” And in a certain limited sense, if you’d like to perpetuate a kleptocracy specializing in corporate plagiarism, it’s a great way to do it. But the human costs a are very, very high, and I’d rather see the actually-smart kids be enabled to do what they do well: frankly, they might be able to make life better for everyone, whether through humane policy work, or creative R&D, or a dozen other ways. The big problem, to me, is that a lot of smart kids who don’t find a way to leave, or aren’t lucky enough to get taken out of the system at some point, get mulched down by a decade and a half inside the system, and end up giving in and adopting the cynical bullshit approach, because they realize it’s the only way to get ahead in Korea.

      Finally, I do very well in my classes for this reason. I bark at the kids, and I control their speech. The younger ones love to learn and sing songs, the older ones grunt a long, but Korea may have ended its dictatorship 15 years before, but itll be a dictatorship for a long long time. Smart people will take advantage of it. Korean society is already shrinking and depressed. Theres no way to fix that. Because in the end, they want these conditions for their society and education. Its a system thats always been there.

      When I read that, what comes to mind is, “Well, a cynical bullshitter finds his home away from home.” I suppose it works for you, at least. I personally felt worn-down after more than a decade of pushing against incredible resistance to every minor suggestion made that could make our kids have a better experience. I was never the teacher willing to bark at the students, and fake my way through a class so that students could fake their way though: the pay was simply not enough for me to set aside my conscience: I needed my work to mean something. And the thing is: it did. There was a small minority of students–between 5-50% of any given class–who benefitted from being actually taught, actually pushed to see things from another point of view.

      I believe, like you, that Korean society is shrinking and depressed, but I don’t see that as unfixable. I just see it as very, very hard to fix… and harder if nobody tries. So I did my best to try encourage students to try. I don’t want to take too much credit, but some of them certainly changed their life paths because of experiences they had in my classes. I know because they came back to the uni and told me so, years after graduating, when there was nothing for them to lose or gain from saying so: “I decided never to work in a chaebol after our course in business and economic imperialism,” or “After our Canadian literature class, I decided that Korea needs Korean literature teachers who teach the way literature is taught in the West, with critical thinking and personal interpretation, so I decided to become a teacher,” or, “I realized that university–and life–are about asking questions and looking for real answers, not just answers for the multiple choice test.”

      You can’t achieve that–or much else to be proud of–by barking at classes and pandering to the lowest common denominator. The problem, of course, is that the work goes unappreciated, especially in an institution desperate for students and income. Which is why I’m much happier teaching freelance: now that we have a good reputation, we can choose the students whom we think have potential to benefit from our teaching, and not waste our time on those who would prefer to be be barked at and game exams. Those, we can say, “… would benefit more from the traditional hakwon system.” I work fewer hours, with far fewer administrative duties and hoop-jumping, and make almost the same amount of money. (And had we started out charging the local going rate, I’d surely be making more money than we were in Korea.)

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3. I’d love to read the second part to this! Very interesting piece!

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   1. Thanks! Cool, I’ll try get it posted in the next week or so. I’m trying to finish off a story I’m working on, and get some other projects done, but I have a rough draft, so it shouldn’t take too long.

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4. Wow, thats a hell of a response, its like part 2 of your article! So, I thank you for your time. Now, we don’t know each other, and I don’t do internet debase or arguments, but now and then Ill post something if I feel I want to contribute my thoughts, so I did. Its dangerous because I don’t feel I have to defend myself or my actions, as we are both 3rd parties to all of this.

   You are surely a writer, wow….anyway

   I cant write volumes like you and I won’t. But maybe Ill say a bit to some of your points.

   Korean society is fixable as anything can be fixed, changed, or improve, but until society itself wants to change itself, and the power structures are very strong sand still in place. The age thing, very solid. I saw it today, something ridiculous, but older vs younger. I think a lot of the changes are surface, superficial, and the biggest changes are the internet showing a lot of people how the modern world outside do it. Thats a lot of countries, but since Korea is a shame culture, I think it did a lot of what many visitors here wished they could do. It became a mirror for people to look at.

   Koreas not my 2nd home, its like my 3rd. In that time, Ive basically worked for one company, a family to be right, and they’ve kept me because even before I could speak Korean, because they knew I could understand them. I don’t have to agree with them or their ways, Im not the boss, but I showed my students/clients/etc who I was and how I lived. I didn’t pass judgement (I actually did constantly) on them, I was like this is me that is you. I let their system run as it does, and I was a light they could get English or play guitar with or whatnot. Kids always called me Hyeong by mistake, and I still get my old students and coworkers from before contacting me, they said “I never smell like a foreigner” although I really do. I didn’t say I was ever a professor or what not, but I did stay with one company 10 years, they kept me, and kept me happy, because I could “turn off the stink.” I worked very hard doing many things for them, and Im proud of what I did with the kids. My job now, a different place, is the same thing.

   I never defend myself, I have no need to mention my business, my finances, how big my member is. Now, thats theres so many foreigners here, I think thats the common internet fare here.

   Im not silly enough to think I can change anything, but I can be something to someone…its not my job to figure it out, Ill just do my job, what ever it may be, and be myself. I pay attention to the people around me. I don’t talk above them, I taught all of my classes the same way, from kinds, to Gangnam Business English. Im not above them, but I have some good ideas. Intellectual imperialism is a harsh reality to these kids, their professors and teachers have them doing some crazy stuff, but I digress.

   By the way, Ive been straight-edge all of my life, so I wouldn’t go to those bars you speak of. I agree that a lot of effects we discussed are not of Confucianism, per se, but results of the dictatorships and the lay of the land (I do think what you called the Benthamite Panopticon some how probably started during the Annexation (where tons of J-funding was poured into Korea, an extension of the Japanese empire, is what I meant)). But, Im not here to argue exact dates (I do know it was more than 15 years ago the dictatorships ended, but some do say KDJ was the first true Democratic president, although NMH was a lawyer and all of that).

   I think one language is infinitely more valuable than another because of what I have invested in it. Thats just common, isn’t it? I read once that the average Korea can use around 500 different phrases or phrasings a day, and the average American can use around 2000. Even if the numbers are inflated, it kind of makes sense. We don’t revel in the sameness, the cultural meaning and brevity of expression. I find we flip and turn words constantly, American English is quite dynamic. May I say like this: we use words to show how different/unique we are, and Koreans use words to show how alike they are. Does that make sense.

   I fear I may have already said too much, but forgive me, I have 3 languages I use daily in my head, fighting for space. Im not as articulate as some, but Im always listening.

   I did notice little insults or putdowns towards me in your volumes here, the sad part about the internet. Just because you write a lot doesn’t mean you’re right at all, nor does having a Korean wife. Ive met very educated people who are educated in all the wrong things, and sometimes common sense and awareness are more than enough as well. You wrote something, and I responded. So I thank you for your time.

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   1. J-Soup,

      Right, well, thanks for your response. I apologize, and admit to the put-downs. It’s me trying to distance myself from some of the things you say, because they sound a lot like the kinds of truisms that circulate in expat circles, and obfuscate things for a lot of people. I would rather not help propagate ideas I disagree with. But I shouldn’t have knocked you personally.

      I’ll try keep my answer shorter.

      Korean society is fixable as anything can be fixed, changed, or improve, but until society itself wants to change itself, and the power structures are very strong sand still in place. The age thing, very solid. I saw it today, something ridiculous, but older vs younger.

      Actually, what I’ve heard a lot of older Koreans who are in touch with young people say is that the age thing is much more of a big deal now than it was thirty years ago. It was a big deal then, but it seems to be hypertrophying now: now you find students who are six months apart, or sometimes little kids only a month or a week apart in age, trying to pull rank on one another. (I have broken up a few fights between little boys because one refused to call the other–a month or less his senior–“형” and the response by older Koreans has consistently been, basically to look on and mouth, “WTF?!?” Back in 2008 or so, there was a whole spate of new articles about that going on in unis: students one year ahead doing insane shit to kids one year behind them, like, “Kneel on the subway platform in the cold,” pulling-rank shit. Especially in programs like ballet or traditional Korean music, for some reason.)

      I think a lot of the changes are surface, superficial, and the biggest changes are the internet showing a lot of people how the modern world outside do it. Thats a lot of countries, but since Korea is a shame culture, I think it did a lot of what many visitors here wished they could do. It became a mirror for people to look at.

      Yep, very true. Though I see internet usage patterns shifting. The average Korean seems to use Facebook way less, and I’ve noticed people using Kakaotalk as if it were a personal mailing list. Closed, walled gardens. Koreans seem to tend toward them and any software platform that doesn’t offer it will get minimal traffic, I think.

      I’ve also had the “You’re not really like other foreigners” thing which, you know: if you said it to a minority friend back home, it’d be an insult to their racial group. It’s really just an admission that one is holding onto one’s own prejuduces about the group, but admitting they don’t apply to the individual at hand. Pretty common worldwide, except I think it’s the sort of thing under-educated morons say in a place like Canada, whereas in Korea, you’ll have PhD professors who spent ten years overseas in America saying it.

      I never defend myself, I have no need to mention my business, my finances, how big my member is. Now, thats theres so many foreigners here, I think thats the common internet fare here.

      The phrase “rootless cosmopolitan” comes to mind. ;) That is, in terms of the defending oneself. I don’t know what you mean by “mention my business” though. I mean the defending oneself. I find most English teachers in Korea pretty inactive when it comes to rights and advocacy stuff, and I was too. It’s interesting: the migrant laborer groups are really strong, organized, and effective. They have a freaking TV channel on cable. English teacher expats in Korea, not so much. I guess because we have less shit to wade through, and the option of returning “home” if we want. Internet fare certainly HAS gone way down in the last ten years, though. Blogs that compare Koreans to “shaved chimps,” for example. That kind of garbage is pretty stomach-turning.

      Im not silly enough to think I can change anything, but I can be something to someone…its not my job to figure it out, Ill just do my job, what ever it may be, and be myself. I pay attention to the people around me. I don’t talk above them, I taught all of my classes the same way, from kinds, to Gangnam Business English. Im not above them, but I have some good ideas. Intellectual imperialism is a harsh reality to these kids, their professors and teachers have them doing some crazy stuff, but I digress.

      See, this is where I think you’re wrong, in a particularly American way. (I’m not saying you’re American, I’m saying it’s a very American-styled conception of change.) If people had always resigned themselves to the fact that they as individuals cannot change things, things would never have changed. The global Left has pretty much fallen apart under the weight of that one inflated recognition, and all the consolation schemes that have arisen to offer relief from the pain of recognizing it. In the past, people understood that individuals couldn’t change things, but also understood that groups of dedicated people can change things. They respected the necessity of cooperation, organization, and working together. We’ve lost that, and it troubles me.

      And that’s really saddening. It means that the people who don’t want change–and who are very organized, and very much a group–win. I’m not saying you need to be a political crusader. I’m saying that starting out with the line, “Im not silly enough to think I can change anything…” isn’t going to lead anywhere better than the present is… and it seems like a capitulation to a false idea, one that is very well-discussed in a book by Russell Jacoby called The End of Utopia. (Hard to find in Korea, but worth it if you can get your hands on it.)

      It’s not just you, by the way. I think the whole world has fallen prey to that kind of status-quo affirming, just-so story thinking. Me too. I just think we collectively need to fight our way back out of it. It’s a life, and one designed to keep things the (toxic, unjust, crazy) way they are.

      I’d say the Panopticon probably has its earliest roots under Japan, but flourished under Park, from what I’ve read and heard–particularly what one Korean history scholar I know talked to me about. Fair point about “real” democracy and all, though, you know… if you side with C. Douglas Lummis, democracy has only ever existed in a minority of most societies, including Korea. Definitions are goalposts we can move around, but the current state of Korean democracy (daughters dictator heads increasingly authoritarian regime) makes me skeptical about any fine line between 1988 and now.

      I think one language is infinitely more valuable than another because of what I have invested in it. Thats just common, isn’t it? I read once that the average Korea can use around 500 different phrases or phrasings a day, and the average American can use around 2000. Even if the numbers are inflated, it kind of makes sense. We don’t revel in the sameness, the cultural meaning and brevity of expression. I find we flip and turn words constantly, American English is quite dynamic. May I say like this: we use words to show how different/unique we are, and Koreans use words to show how alike they are. Does that make sense.

      Sure, I suppose, but it’s also down to the fact Koreans discuss a much narrower range of things in daily life. Small talk is narrowly constrained in both cultures are first, but my wife constantly complains of how hard it is to have a good conversation in Korean: people so often just shoot down any attempt to go deeper into any topic, and finally conversations end up just being (and staying) shallow. When she runs up on an exception–people who REALLY talk about things–it’s always amazing for her, whereas for me it’s just good, or great. For her, it’s like a feast after months of starvation.

      Again, apologies for the insults and putdowns. And I know having a Korean spouse isn’t a shortcut to being an expert: I’ve known more than enough Koreans who didn’t know their own country’s history, and more than enough expat married to such individuals who were just as clueless. I mention my wife’s comments because they’re pertinent, not as a claim on expertise.

      Ive met very educated people who are educated in all the wrong things, and sometimes common sense and awareness are more than enough as well.

      Oh, yes.

      And thank you in return for your clarifications. The second of which I’ll get to in a bit, but I have a lesson now…

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5. Oh and maybe one more thing. I do think the idea of the functions of “education” and “learning” are not the same at all for Koreans and us Westerners, Thats a big point. For me, Im super curious about the world. I know a lot of weird esoteric subjects, and have used some of that knowledge for my own betterment and profit. My parents saw the good in teaching me that, but I realize that the parents here don’t value that part, as much (although I have met some parent oddly who have many hobbies, and their kids do too, thats awesome!). The Socratic Method is a door leading to a another door, and so on and so forth, but here, people are not looking for doors upon doors, they want a method to get to their valued goals (good job, what have you), so by default, the KSAT has become the dictate for that. Thats their choice, because thats their societies values. I would die if I had to give up a iota of my self-expressions. I dig Geography a lot but I stump my kids and adults over and over, and thats because they dont value that. Do I look down on them because I cant fathom why they wouldnt want to go to the Greek Isles or most commonly, where is India (more get it wrong than right :) ).

   I never think English teachers are here in Korea to teach English, because like I said, language is a path to communicate with others, and thats not what Korea is about, but I think, in my own case, Im someone they want to communicate with. I think of myself as a trainer of sorts. Even now, I teach two company owners and then 3rd graders, and they all have been with me for a long time. I know what the kids parents want, I know what I can give them, and theyre competitive and can be mean, theyre K-kids, but if youre attentive, you can use that to your advantage, right? I also have great hours, btw. Not every Hagwon is the same, as you know. No way would I make my own place though. Thats just me,. Anyway…

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   1. Oh and maybe one more thing. I do think the idea of the functions of “education” and “learning” are not the same at all for Koreans and us Westerners, Thats a big point.

      Well… I think it works out that way. I think optimally, education anywhere is striated. That is, it’s set up so that the people who want some kind of perfunctory, technical accreditation get that without dragging the whole system down to the level of perfunctory accreditation. The problem is that in Korea–but also, increasingly, back in places like Canada and the US–people believe they cannot survive without a Bachelor’s degree at the very minimum. (And in both societies, that belief isn’t completely fantasy, I should add.)

      What I mean is: people who are “super curious about the world” tend to serve a very useful function in the world. When the educational system is set up right, they become our philosophers, our inventors, innovators, and creators. They have education systems that facilitate that–something that is more important as the world gets more complex. And by extension, I am saying is that the Socratic Method isn’t just useful for one society or another; it’s a universally useful method of inquiry, as is scientific method. It is applicable across cultures, and can do important work within any culture.

      I think the main difference between our views on this roots in one question: why are people the way they are? You write:

      The Socratic Method is a door leading to a another door, and so on and so forth, but here, people are not looking for doors upon doors, they want a method to get to their valued goals (good job, what have you), so by default, the KSAT has become the dictate for that. Thats their choice, because thats their societies values.

      But I would argue that this is too simplistic. Choice when it is constrained this way isn’t choice anymore than slicing off your own leg to escape a bear trap is a “choice.” I don’t think the “choice” is value neutral, either: when I look at it, I look at who the status quo benefits, and it seems clear to me that the beneficiaries are the ones with a vested interest in the status quo.

      Which is to say, the education system is the way it is in Korea because the chaebol and the government have a vested interest in keeping it the way it is–and if they wanted or needed it to be some other way, and felt they could afford the (non-monetary) risks, they would push to make it happen. They may wring their hands about the quality of recent graduates, but quality is a double-edged sword, and you can be sure that if Korean students were schooled in a way that encouraged critical thinking, assertiveness, and debate, that sooner or later Korean workers would be more critical, assertive, and ready to debate their employers in terms of working conditions, benefits, and so on. (Because, by and large, Koreans are paid less for longer hours, fewer holidays and vacation days, and with worse working conditions than most of their OECD peers.) In fact, I’ve long thought that the corporate practice of preferentially hiring seniors prior to graduation and having them skip school to work full time–but also receive course credit–is one of the ways that corporations in Korea sabotage higher education. (It’s fairly common, and sends a hell of a message to the other students.)

      All of which is to say that education is inherently political, in Korea like anywhere, and especially in terms of its usefulness as a tool of stagmatizing and stifling dissent, shaping norms, and training people in intangible lessons like obedience and self-abnegation. But don’t take it from me: among many authors, a personal favorite of mine on this subject is John Taylor Gatto.

      I never think English teachers are here in Korea to teach English, because like I said, language is a path to communicate with others, and thats not what Korea is about, but I think, in my own case, Im someone they want to communicate with. I think of myself as a trainer of sorts. Even now, I teach two company owners and then 3rd graders, and they all have been with me for a long time. I know what the kids parents want, I know what I can give them, and theyre competitive and can be mean, theyre K-kids, but if youre attentive, you can use that to your advantage, right? I also have great hours, btw. Not every Hagwon is the same, as you know. No way would I make my own place though. Thats just me,. Anyway…

      Well, comparing notes:

      I think of myself as a resource for students. With my adult students, usually they have two purposes for lessons with me: one is to have a nice chat with someone outside their social circle, or, in some cases, to act as a surrogate for their truncated social life living abroad. (Lots of Koreans have trouble making friends in a new place, and the Korean social circles most available are also the most stifling.) The other purpose is to provide them with slow, cumulative English skills in as unthreatening and interesting a way as possible, and I do that: they get some very simple homework, I check it, drill with them as necessary, and then train them in things like small talk and so on–the stuff that is habitually overlooked in language education, but crucial to actual use of the language. (Because, I should add: most of the adult students I teach actually do want or need to improve their English for work purposes. They’re living overseas and use English as the primary language of communication with non-Korean coworkers, employees, and so on. With the occasional housewives, it’s different–my wife teaches most of the housewives anyway–but even some of them are motivated by a desire to interact with their kids’ teachers and English-speaking friends…)

      With the kids, though… well, it depends on the kid. Following the lines above:

      With the Homeschooled and International school kids, I tend to teach them other stuff, using English as the language of instruction. Lately, that’s been stuff like the basics of astronomy and science, Roman history, some literature, but also making time for stuff like grammar drills, pronunciation, speaking with natural stresses (iambs, trochees, and anapests, though I don’t call them that with the kids), and so on. I also try to make time for other approaches to practicing their English. With several kids, we do D&D- or Traveler-like RPGs but integrate heavily the material studied: with one kid, the world’s magic system functions off grammar structures, with whatever we’re drilling being a tool for magic spells in combat. With another, since he’s studying a book on the solar system, we use information as part of his question from planet to planet to solve a mystery… and so on.

      With the “Korean International-schooled” kids, I do some of that, but there is inevitably another function I end up having to serve: the one I mention at the end of my post, and which I’ll talk more about in the next one…

      Reply

6. Thank you, I have always stayed away from Expat circles. I never find them useful, mostly.

   Luckily nowadays, theres more and more social involvement and more charity donations (not as many adoptions I hear).

   I have no idea what I would protest after 10+ years here. Donating time or money to a worthy cause, maybe. Im an only child, so I have that selfishness (in droves).

   I met a foreigner head of a business organization here to discuss life here and we both agree in Korea, alot of expats love to run around and do this and that, but the market and land! is too small. Too many big fish in a small pond, and then add every Korean trying to do the same. Alot of people trying to do something, but in the end, the Business head also said, there isnt alot of results from these people doing something here. I understand the ambition, but you have to work with ALL things within the soup that is Korea. It makes thing constricting

   But with the internet, there are avenues overseas. Thats the hope.

   Reply

   1. Yeah, expat circles are not my thing either. I prefer circles that are open to anyone, expat or Korean, who is willing to put the time in to fit into the group. (For example, while I don’t love every homebrewer I’ve met in Korea, in general it was a very good crowd, and one that was happily growing much more integrated the longer it existed.)

      Social involvement: maybe, but it’s still pretty limited. Most of the time when I mention charities, people looked at me with bafflement. And yeah, adoption is still very unpopular.

      As for protest: I can think of a bunch of things right off the top of my head, but I imagine you can guess them from my comments, or the rest of my blog, so I won’t belabour the point beyond saying that there are things in Korea that need to change. For example, the fact that if my wife and I have a kid, my name cannot appear as the birth father on the family rolls in Korea. (There are obvious custody implications in the case of death or divorce of the Korean spouse, and the same law in Japan was reformed in 2009 for the very reasons I mention.) There’s the treatment of migrant workers; there’s the status of women; there’s the hatred that homosexuals endure (and, you know, the gay activist crowd is very strong, active, and militant now… and working not only on gay rights but other minority rights, like the rights of the handicapped). Speaking of which…

      There’s so damned much. It’s just that, as an outsider, protesting may not be directly useful. Teaching, though, is a place where you can bring up these things. A small proportion of your students will be interested, curious, and think about what you’ve taught. Maybe more than a small one, if you’re a really good teacher. That has t count for something. And then there’s writing: I have on occasion written things for magazines or journals that cover Korean issues, hoping to draw attention overseas to an issue. I haven’t done enough, myself, but I console myself with the fact that I spent inordinate amounts of time and energy on working with students, counseling them (some, back from the brink of suicide from living with all these pressures and with the palpable sense of hopelessness so many young people in Korea feel today), and trying to bring issues into my teaching, because so many students told me that one of my classes was the first class where they ever had a serious intellectual discussion about anything.

      As for the soup that is Korea: I dunno. I know plenty of foreigners making waves. I can point to at least one scene that I played a small part in helping to build up: the growing craft brew scene. I was less active than many, but I was part of that tiny homebrewing scene that is now exploding as more and more people with spare cash get into the microbrewing/craft beer business in Korea. It’s an example of how people can make a change, even with very oppressive conditions. (Korea’s laws about commercial brewing are a crazily restrictive; the best analogy I can think of is having a law against anyone under six feet five inches tall ever playing basketball in front of an audience anywhere in the country. The analogous trait to height here is, of course, money.) But somehow, there are people–foreign and Korean alike changing things up, radically. So it is possible.

      One doesn’t need to do it in a specific way. There are many roads that lead to a potentially better world. My wife makes films–consciously critical, consciously political, outspoken ones. That’s how she fights for a better world. It’s a long game, so it’s best to find a way to fight while doing something you love.

      Reply

7. Oh and the “smell like a foreigner” comment, in the US, its a insult and Id take it as that. Here, it means I get opportunites for business, etc. Cultural relativism. I think the smart person is the one who recognizes this. YMMV

   Reply

   1. Meh to cultural relativism. I’m sorry, but it’s just racism, plain and simple. It’s not institutionalized racism–which also exists in Korea–but it is racism. That’s very simple: when one generalizes about a group of people based on their race, it’s racism. Most of the racism one encounters as an expat in Korea is of this kind, sometimes clueless, often received without critical thought. (Koreans who know better run across it a lot more: it seems not all that uncommon for young Koreans to say things that are incredibly bigoted, when they’re among only other Koreans. For example, one classmate of my wife’s in college thought it was fun to criticize people’s restaurant suggestions by saying, “That’s gook food… that’s nigger food… that’s chink food.” Not one single person ever criticized it till my wife did.) And then, of course, there is some institutionalized racism, some of it not really mitigated fully by white privilege.

      But this stuff, this is the more street-level, non-institutionalized stuff. However much they can be separated, this is just bigoted thinking, more than anything.

      But it’s still racist, insulting shit. My wife had to endure her high school “friends” pretty constantly “shit-talking” [white] foreigners as “sex-predators” who “stalk Hongdae” looking for “stupid girls” to “take advantage of.” This is after years of knowing me personally, after meeting countless friends of mine who are nothing like that. When she called them on it, saying, “You do realize I’m engaged to a white foreigner, right?” they tended to say things like, “Well, Gord’s not like that, of course, but…”

      The bigoted attitude does link to institutionalized stuff, of course. It’s the same attitude that requires E2 visa holders to get an HIV test, but doesn’t require the same of mail-order brides from countries with higher rates of HIV infection than the home countries of the E2 visa holders. (I’m not against testing, but I am against racist profiling: test all immigrants, test all teachers if you must, but don’t just test one group… much less doing so in violation of a constitution that ostensibly applies to everyone in your borders, foreigners included, and in violation of an international law to which your nation is a signatory.) And the government basically instituted this at the behest of a hate group that openly operated in Korea at the time.

      It’s the same ridiculously xenophobic attitude that lies behind the insanity of considering having every foreign who came to Korean for the ’88 Seoul Olympics tested for HIV… an idea that was floated, and only abandoned when the world responded with shock and criticism… not to mention all the over-the-top insanity that followed that year. (More in the posts throughout the series linked at the top of this post.)

      Chinese foreigners, Chinese-Koreans, north Koreans, blacks, Southeast Asians, Koreans of mixed ancestry… pretty much anyone who isn’t a “pure” South Korean born and raised (or able to pass for one) is subject to the same xenophobic crap–just, in varying degrees and extremes.

      I presume that you benefit from the white privilege that smooths off some of the sharp edges (as do I) but it doesn’t erase the racist nature of the charge. The people who say such things have racist attitudes. It might be to your advantage when they take a shine to you, but it doesn’t make them less bigoted, any more than it’s not bigoted to say something like “You’re not lazy like other blacks!” to a black employee in America, or, “I’m so glad you’re not nerdy like most Asians…” to an Asian-American employee: it’s obviously and patently racist, even if it’s well-intentioned and even if it’s within the context of a scenario supposedly beneficial to the person who’s being told that.

      The clever person sees the potential benefit, the sweet treat, and may choose to take advantage of it in the short term… but I suspect that the truly intelligent person recognizes sooner or later that in the long run, the candy is laced with enough arsenic or dioxin to make it a bad choice of subsistence. To recall a line from one Chinese academic I read once, about the CCP: “When they loosen the [censorship] belt, you have to remember, they can always tighten it back up again.”

      Which is to say: when someone tells you you’re alright for a foreigner, or better than other foreigners, that’s the first shoe dropping. Given enough time and even a moderate amount of conflict, inevitably the other shoe will drop, and that’s when you hear “I was wrong about you! You’re just the same as all foreigners.”

      (I should add, this is more in a business/work setting I’m talking about. In my personal relationships, it has happened, but less. One of my exes said to me something vaguely like this–“I forgot for a while that you’re not Korean…” but she meant more that the line in her head between “Us” and “Them” had been suspended, and that the dichotomy didn’t seem so important to her. That’s different than being compared positively in contrast to the horrible others of one’s “kind”…. which I am convinced always leaves the door open to one being once against castigated for being not better than one’s kind, when it suits one’s interlocutor.)

      Reply

      1. Yeah, like I said Im straight edge. I dont drink, smoke, or do any mind alteration (love Zeppelin though). I met the guy who run Magpie, and I know the ingredience are super taxed, but I have no interest in all of that, and actually, home brewing I dont feel is anything really noteworthy. Its just theyre doing it in Korea, but still, a small drop in the pond.

         I know what you mean about “Big Business” but since Korea GDP is what 25.6% of it is from Samsung? (and 3% from prostitution :) ). Ill keep it right where it is, and most of Korea will as well. I try never to compare why isnt Korea like this or that. IMO I think Korea is one big factory for the Chaebol, they make the business here, and they inspire the students to work there. I know theres tons of small arts movements. I know of many people who graduated design school and such, and guess what, theyre working for the bigger companies, or they want. If youre a smaller designer, you can make a shop, but youll sit in that shop drinking stick coffee and relying on your husbands income, I think (I just know a bit about clothing, so I may the reference).

         Gay rights? Im not gay, thats not for me to say. Womens rights? Well, my mom was a member of the NOW, so I got a good liberal education. Going to a rally isnt going to make a big difference. Maybe getting literature to a womens group would be good, but Koreans are just learning these things in droves (womens rights started in the 60s here, as you know, they had a bit of a kurfluffel too). Migrant workers? I just want them to stop calling those churches for Phillipinas “Foreign Centers.” These migrant dudes nowadays may not be a financially well off and may not speak English (as well) but theyre armed and they have the internet. Im a white Westerner, and I definitely wont insult them (and probably wont be welcome to) by trying to save them, esp if I dont speak their languages.

         Films are difficult here, as esp non-major budget films they are a much smaller audience (my best pal is a Hollywood Director actually, so I was around him alot, I may have a bit on knowledge here too). You have to get the subject and the actors that are relative to the message. You have to have ALOT of tiptoeing (esp here), make sure you give enough respect, otherwise itll end up just being a observing sport. That also isnt bad. I always say Sex and the City gave a big boost to the women here. I remember them telling me they wanted to walk around with a coffee wearing nice clothes just like those characters (you remember, walking around with food outside was a big nono here and in Japan, maybe China too, now its normal, whew).

         I influence my kids by not letting them talk bad about black people, Japanese, or other kids. Everybody must have manners, and we must respect everyone. All of my kids classes know the expression “Dont be rude!” among others, and they use it (as well as Yes Maam or Sir, and I never let them say Oh My God, but oh my goodness or gosh, and never swear!). I always show them that kimchi is as delicious as a hamburger, as a Peroggi, as a plate of Locomoco. I show them with my ipad all kinds of things. I guess its being a cultural ambassador. I show them my youtube channel, when I go to Japan (which I do often), I bring candies, as well as when I go home. I show them pictures of my international friends, and they ask me words in the other langauges I know, or know of. I think thats a big lack here. A lot of the NETS dont use their positions to show off their cultures and such. Theres enough foreign loanwords to use in class nowadays for cultural touch points.

         Also, racism. Look, Korea is racist (everywhere is, but its blatant here). It just goes into the us versus them thing. As long as it doesnt bother my business here, they can say what they want. In 10+ years, Ive never been bothered or hassled, and thats because (if I may say) I have street smarts. Im not from the backwaters of any southern state you may. I think thats one thing. Foreigners here should learn how to carry themselves, its not that hard. Im 6ft, Im big enough. If some old ajushii doesnt like me (where I am now, are bunches of those lower tier factory workers, they look at me, and I look right back). Odd enough, I dont have any of those stories about old men hassling my gf’s. I’ve heard them, but I have none. If I may say, I think its the aura one carries around themselves, but thats just me.

         I know those stories too: youre just like us, and the minute you screw up, youre not like us! I dont need the validation. I need the opportunity to make money. Its just business. If I was denied hospitalization or such, Id raise holy hell, but Ive never had that (I think my speaking the language decently has a lot to do with it).

         Bigots? What do I care? If they lay a finger on me, their day is ruined. A lot of people say bigoted things or stupid things. Do you really think you can change their mind? Relavant to the situation, you could correct the
         m (and should), but if they gain more from saying bigoted things, then they will continue. In korea, its the norm, and not many people care otherwise. Langauge is self serving, no?

         I also strive to be intellectual, but I feel I need to speak about social issues (like I said, not looking down on others, big world outside of Korea) and things they know of. My older clients know I have many interests and I use those for classes. They follow along, mostly, I suggest music, its more exact in my case.

         I don’t care about the HIV thing. Its a job requirement. If people actually said it to me as a point of derision, Id be up in arms. The few times people said something to that effect, I gave them an earful.
         I don’t know exactly, but it seems foreign dudes are having a lot of fun here, and a lot of K-gals (and some K-guys too) are testing the waters, so I think they don’t care much about it either.

         The xenophobia is laughable. Ive been around it forever. Most people who know me know better than to say silly things like that, I get on a bus full of old people you know its in their head, but mostly
         I see them hating each other. Its empty headed existence incarnate, is it not? I have no time for that.

         Considering having every person tested? You know man, Korea has little to none of the Socratic method and near nil for logical reasoning. People here generally speak based on their feelings and (based on the social conditioning) their expectations/demands stemming from their position to others. Emotionalism at its finest. I thank god everyday for my parents teaching me “cool heads prevail” and to be inquisitive.

         We’ve always had people say Korea is this, US is that.b Thts just from them speaking to heighten their feeling. Its actually true, you are the words you say, unfortunately, you have to have facts and efforts to back it up.

         This is fun for me too. I never get to express my opinions on this stuff. To most people who see me, Im the white dude in the leather jacket in the coffee place everyday. Ha.

         Im not as succinct as you are, oboviously, but I hope I get my points across. Sorry if my writing isn’t very exact. Im not a writer, but people have asked me to write a blog or a book, but I have no interest in it. In the end,
         I don’t feel the place I live is that significant to warrant a book beyond the look at this f—ed up situation. But this is fun talking to you.

         Reply

         1. J-Soup,

            Yeah, like I said Im straight edge. I dont drink, smoke, or do any mind alteration (love Zeppelin though). I met the guy who run Magpie, and I know the ingredience are super taxed, but I have no interest in all of that, and actually, home brewing I dont feel is anything really noteworthy. Its just theyre doing it in Korea, but still, a small drop in the pond.

            Okay, a couple of things:

            1. As for being straight-edge and not caring about the brewing scene: it’s fine for you not to drink. But it’s ignorant of you to just dismiss this or that thing as irrelevant just because you don’t care for it.

            I mean, I feel comfortable dismissing Kpop on a musical level: it’s disposable corporate dreck. But I in all intellectual honesty, if you travel at all in Southeast Asia, you cannot just dismiss it in terms of how it’s affecting the pop music scene or business elsewhere: in places ranging from Taiwan to Cambodia and Laos, and definitely here in Vietnam, I’ve seen local acts imitating Korean groups the way they would have been imitating American ones ten or twenty years ago.

            2. You’ll have to just take my word for it: homebrewing–and not just expat homebrewing, the homebrewing Koreans do as well–has driven an important change in the beer culture of Korea. That important change has only just begun, and of course it’s going to take many years–if ever–before the Korean megabrew companies feel the effects of it… but on the ground, there are droves more Koreans who are growing beer-literate, and growing more aware of the various styles of beer available outside Korea, and are starting to demand that kind of stuff be available in Korea. It’s changing the industry, both in terms of import/export, and in terms of diversifying local production: more jobs for more people involved in craft beer, that is, in making something better than the chemical-ish crap that the biggest brewers in Korea pass off as beer. (Which, since you don’t drink, I’ll tell you: it’s worse than the national beer almost anywhere else in Asia. Even third world crapsack nations like Laos and North Korea makes better beer than South Korean brewing companies.) The fact that it’s still nascent now, doesn’t mean it’s irrelevant. (The speed of the change is actually astonishing. What took fifty or sixty years in the US is happening almost overnight in Korea.) In other words: dismiss it as a drop in the pond if you like, but you obviously don’t know what you’re talking about.

            I know what you mean about “Big Business” but since Korea GDP is what 25.6% of it is from Samsung? (and 3% from prostitution :) ). Ill keep it right where it is, and most of Korea will as well. I try never to compare why isnt Korea like this or that. IMO I think Korea is one big factory for the Chaebol, they make the business here, and they inspire the students to work there. I know theres tons of small arts movements. I know of many people who graduated design school and such, and guess what, theyre working for the bigger companies, or they want. If youre a smaller designer, you can make a shop, but youll sit in that shop drinking stick coffee and relying on your husbands income, I think (I just know a bit about clothing, so I may the reference).

            Well, GDP is a good measure of how companies are doing. It’s not really reflective of how much that results in trickle-down benefits people. People who work for Samsung are “well-paid” by Korean standards, but the average pay in Korea for most positions doesn’t compare well with other leading economies, and the have/have-not gap is growing rapidly in Korea.

            The thing you hold up as a reason to keep the status quo–the dominance of Samsung to the South Korean economy–is precisely the reason that such chaebol (zaibatsu) were broken up in Japan after the war: they lead to too much domestic power and dominance, too much influence on government, and so on. You act as if people ought to be grateful to Samsung, when in fact it’s Samsung who ought to be grateful to the people… much more grateful than it is, because they let it slide when Samsung amassed as much financial power as plenty of small countries, and attendant political power as well.

            As for people in the small arts movements: I don’t know any fashion designers. I do know independent filmmakers, and basically, they spend their days doing day jobs, just like creative types all over the world. I know one guy who is a commercial cameraman and mostly makes Kpop videos (dreck by design, explicitly: they ask for dreck) and in my wife’s circle there are others who do things like working in publishing or other day jobs. But also: a lot of creatives abandon ship. They feel Korea’s increasingly hopeless, that its value system has been irrevocably skewed. And it has: the almighty won outweighs every other concern. When the indie film Wonang Sori was an unexpected hit in the cinemas, you know what Lee Myung Bak’s comment was? “How much money has it made?” Not, “What’s it about?” or, “Gee, I wonder if the popularity of the film reflects some issue on the public’s mind,” but, “How much has it made?”

            Which is to say that I’ve met very few creatives outside the literary arts who wish to stay in Korea. In my wife’s filmmaking circles, plenty of people–especially the women–feel it’s best or even necessary to leave the country to do their creative work. The visual artists I’ve met have all gone abroad and are dying to go back, the designers I’ve known have wanted to go live overseas, and so on. It’s different with pop musicians, because they generally are dependent on Korean-speaking audiences, but instrumentalists I’ve known in fields like classical and jazz have nearly all expressed to me a desire to go abroad.

            Gay rights? Im not gay, thats not for me to say.

            Nor am I gay: why does that matter? It’s a human rights issue. A civilized person holds precious the human rights of other people, and expects the same in return: not just the human rights of one’s own affinity groups.

            Womens rights? Well, my mom was a member of the NOW, so I got a good liberal education. Going to a rally isnt going to make a big difference. Maybe getting literature to a womens group would be good, but Koreans are just learning these things in droves (womens rights started in the 60s here, as you know, they had a bit of a kurfluffel too).

            Well, see: you’re wrong. A recognizable women’s rights movement in Korea started in the Japanese occupation (at the very latest; I don’t think it existed in the Joseon). They actually were very strong and active in campaigning for things like women’s education, but when the male-dominated independence movement offered to help solve women’s issues later, after independence was achieved, in exchange for them joining the greater movement… well, you can guess what happened. The women joined up, and the movement got more power… and when independence finally happened, the women’s movement’s concerns were chucked out like so much trash.(And they were swept under the rug, such that plenty of Koreans believe what you just said: the mistaken idea that the women’s movement in Korea started in the 1960s.)

            And that, by the way, illustrates why it’s wrong-headed to see an issue as relevant only when it caters to one’s affinity group. Men did that with women’s issues, and women in Korea still suffer as a result of it, despite “holding up half the sky.” (Or more. In my old neighborhood, all the small family businesses were supposedly co-run by couples, but it was the women who were competent and on hand all the time; when they were left along for a few hours, the husbands in these small businesses were often stunningly incompetent: one guy didn’t know where the finished dry cleaning part of the store was, and another guy literally couldn’t operate half the machines in his own miller shop without his wife around.)

            Migrant workers? I just want them to stop calling those churches for Phillipinas “Foreign Centers.” These migrant dudes nowadays may not be a financially well off and may not speak English (as well) but theyre armed and they have the internet. Im a white Westerner, and I definitely wont insult them (and probably wont be welcome to) by trying to save them, esp if I dont speak their languages.

            Why not call them “Foreign Centers”? Filipinas are as much foreign as you or I. (Granted, they have to put up with being called “migrant workers” even when they’re not migrant workers–the term has taken on a racist connotation in recent years, it means “poor/dirty Southeast Asian” now–but I always emphasize to students that Filipinas, South Asians, and Southeast Asians are just as much 외국인 as white people.)

            And I’m not talking about saving people: I’m talking about things to protest. See, this is the thing, like most watered-down leftists, you’re convinced that it has to be your own affinity group or there’s no point getting involved. That’s a significant part of why the left is losing out these days. Anyone with any interest in human rights has a vested interest in the human rights of all specific subgroups, not just because it’s moral–which is my primary motivation–but also because it’s strategically more effective for all of us to come together on that agreed-upon platform: gays and women and racial minorities can all agree that they all deserve equal human rights. It’s a way of finding common ground, instead of letting our identity-politics differences separate us.

            Granted, that also means a lot of white straight male (or white straight female, for that matter) activists need to learn to shut up and listen to the others, and to regard those people with respect. But these days we’re so mired down by identity politics that we can’t achieve any kind of solidarity.

            Films are difficult here, as esp non-major budget films they are a much smaller audience (my best pal is a Hollywood Director actually, so I was around him alot, I may have a bit on knowledge here too). You have to get the subject and the actors that are relative to the message. You have to have ALOT of tiptoeing (esp here), make sure you give enough respect, otherwise itll end up just being a observing sport. That also isnt bad. I always say Sex and the City gave a big boost to the women here. I remember them telling me they wanted to walk around with a coffee wearing nice clothes just like those characters (you remember, walking around with food outside was a big nono here and in Japan, maybe China too, now its normal, whew).

            Well, if you know anyone in the Korean film industry, you’ll know that the system as it is set up is, once again, primarily functioning for the benefit of the big companies. CJ and Showbox and the rest are the biggest benefactors of the screen quota, for example, or the government subsidies for the film industry… which stifles things. I don’t mean the big film companies should be gutted, but there’s a lot of support to the high-end commercial side, and very little support for developing the nascent talent.

            As for Sex and the City: well, that connects to my theory of why science fiction is so marginal in South Korea, while it is so massive in places just next door like China and Japan. One of the reasons, not the main one, but one of them, is that American mainstream pop culture serves the same purpose. SATC is a radical feminist utopia for a lot of young Korean women: it’s utopian to think a woman could walk around drinking coffee in nice clothes without being called names; it’s utopian to think a Korean girl could just up and boink anyone she wants, but remain an independent woman and not have trouble finding a man; it’s utopian to see women in positions of economic independence and power; it’s utopian to see them happily single in their 30s, and not being pressured by everyone they see to hurry and get married or face Doom. For someone like me, SATC is sexist dreck, but by Korean standards it’s practically Ursula K. Le Guin-level gender-critical utopian SF.

            I influence my kids by not letting them talk bad about black people, Japanese, or other kids. Everybody must have manners, and we must respect everyone. All of my kids classes know the expression “Dont be rude!” among others, and they use it (as well as Yes Maam or Sir, and I never let them say Oh My God, but oh my goodness or gosh, and never swear!). I always show them that kimchi is as delicious as a hamburger, as a Peroggi, as a plate of Locomoco. I show them with my ipad all kinds of things. I guess its being a cultural ambassador. I show them my youtube channel, when I go to Japan (which I do often), I bring candies, as well as when I go home. I show them pictures of my international friends, and they ask me words in the other langauges I know, or know of. I think thats a big lack here. A lot of the NETS dont use their positions to show off their cultures and such. Theres enough foreign loanwords to use in class nowadays for cultural touch points.

            That’s all nice. It’s good. I don’t really think of it as subversive, but it’s a start, I suppose. Kids having some outlet, some window on the rest of the planet, its a big thing.

            Also, racism. Look, Korea is racist (everywhere is, but its blatant here). It just goes into the us versus them thing. As long as it doesnt bother my business here, they can say what they want. In 10+ years, Ive never been bothered or hassled, and thats because (if I may say) I have street smarts. Im not from the backwaters of any southern state you may. I think thats one thing. Foreigners here should learn how to carry themselves, its not that hard. Im 6ft, Im big enough. If some old ajushii doesnt like me (where I am now, are bunches of those lower tier factory workers, they look at me, and I look right back). Odd enough, I dont have any of those stories about old men hassling my gf’s. I’ve heard them, but I have none. If I may say, I think its the aura one carries around themselves, but thats just me.

            You sound like me until it happened to me. I, too, used to believe that it’s carriage. I knew a guy who kept getting into fights with drunk ajeoshis who were attacking his girlfriend, calling her whore and slut and bitch, and so on. He broke his arm in a fight “defending” her from (ostensible) nationalist rapists in a bathroom of a hof on the highway; then, a week or two later, he re-broke the same bone defending her honor in a restaurant down the street. But the guy strutted in a confrontational way, staring nastily at every ajeoshi he met. So I chalked it up to, “He’s an asshole, and it shows, so he attracts assholes like flies to shit.”

            Then, one day, I got attacked by a drunk ajeoshi, a complete stranger, simply because I was walking while foreign. I had headphones in and didn’t respond in a clown-like when when he screamed “Hello!” at me, and suddenly there was a strange man rushing me, shouting insults. I didn’t behave aggressively; I didn’t insult him. He was just a fucked up person. This was in Yongsan station, though, and I lived on Yeokgok, which is one of the worst neighborhoods in the country. (I had little choice, I worked there and liked my job but the housing was also there, but the cabbies for example were basically the Korean equivalent of neo-Nazi thugs and mobsters.) When I moved to Yeokgok, incidents multiplied. So it’s a matter of a lot of things, and you’re probably not just free of such incidents because of some a little skillful self-carriage: it’s likely as much where you live, where you hang out, and the luck of the draw.

            I know those stories too: youre just like us, and the minute you screw up, youre not like us! I dont need the validation. I need the opportunity to make money. Its just business. If I was denied hospitalization or such, Id raise holy hell, but Ive never had that (I think my speaking the language decently has a lot to do with it).

            I’ve never heard of an expat being denied hospitalization.

            And I would appreciate it if you didn’t go around implying that anyone who cares about racism is begging for validation. There are plenty of other reasons to have issues with the racism in Korea than a personal desire for validation. (And for the record, I’ve always considered the racism faced by nonwhites in Korea–especially Southeast Asians–to be much more serious than anything I had to deal with.)

            Bigots? What do I care? If they lay a finger on me, their day is ruined. A lot of people say bigoted things or stupid things. Do you really think you can change their mind? Relavant to the situation, you could correct them (and should), but if they gain more from saying bigoted things, then they will continue. In korea, its the norm, and not many people care otherwise. Langauge is self serving, no?

            By “their day is ruined” I think you mean you’d defend yourself, right? Are you under the impression that you have a hope in hell at equal protection under the law? That the “bigotry” you condone won’t result in bystanders claiming you were at fault in any assault or confrontation leading to violence? I’ve heard the story so many times, and not just second-hand but first-hand as well, of people being attacked, defending themselves, and then having the police accept the testimony of Korean bystanders that the foreigner started the confrontation.

            As for the rest: I agree that if the HIV thing were a job requirement only, it’d be a simple case of public health policy. But it’s not: they would be testing the women brought into the country to work in the sex trade, were that the case. (As well as Koreans going to places like Southeast Asia, especially countries notorious as sex tour destinations among Korean men.) I don’t see how the sexual activities of foreigners and Koreans relate to the disparity in testing. If Korea tested all foreigners, fine–though, you know, if it does violate their constitution, it should give them pause. (I imagine an HIV-positive Korean in America being detained and deported for his illness would probably make waves in the Korean media.) Also, some Korean companies also insist on their employees being tested for HIV… and the hospitals are conventionally so ignorant of the law that they break it and inform the employers of any cases. Which isn’t just illegal, it’s a human rights violation: HIV-positive office-workers being fired for their illness is illegal in Korea.

            (There’s also a question of why HIV testing would be a job requirement for people working with children. The implication is obviously that foreigners are going to rape children. It’s an insulting implication, especially when Koreans working with children are not subject to the same requirements… even though there are thousands of cases on record of Korean adults being charged with pedophilia, and only something like seven of foreigners. (Those are only reported cases, mind, but the majority of the cases involving Koreans resulted in suspended sentences, an outcome I cannot imagine when a non-Korean is involved. Also, I imagine that every case involving a foreigner has gone to the courts, while I know personally of enough cases where there was an out-of-court settlement and no charges were laid when there was a Korean assailant. At least three Korean women have told me such stories from their own lives; and then there’s unreported cases. So it’s a sure bet that the 2000-odd cases are only the most extreme ones, and that pedophilia is actually much more common than those court statistics suggest.)

            All of which adds up to the conclusion that Korea’s not serious about protecting children; it’s serious about using the idea of “protecting children” from rapist foreigners who have HIV, for political capital. (Or,in the case of the now-defunct Anti-English Spectrum hate group, using the meme as a way of justifying their racism and expelling foreigners en masse.) Which is to say, the policy is about race-hate, not about public health management.)

            I don’t know exactly, but it seems foreign dudes are having a lot of fun here, and a lot of K-gals (and some K-guys too) are testing the waters, so I think they don’t care much about it either.

            I fail to see the relevance.

            The xenophobia is laughable. Ive been around it forever. Most people who know me know better than to say silly things like that, I get on a bus full of old people you know its in their head, but mostly I see them hating each other. Its empty headed existence incarnate, is it not? I have no time for that.

            Sure, but it’s empty-headedness enshrined in legislation. It’s unequal pay for equal (if not harder) work. It’s unequal regulations about custody of children. It’s about unequal laws governing public health policy… wrongheaded laws that by the way facilitate the spread of HIV by reinforcing the idea it’s a “foreign pervert” disease when the vast majority of cases of transmission now in Korea are Korean-to-Korean. Which is to say: it’s actively counterproductive. It’s helping make HIV spread. It’s killing people. You can shrug because you’re likely not among the people being killed, but that, too, strikes me as empty-headedness incarnate.

            We’ve always had people say Korea is this, US is that.b Thts just from them speaking to heighten their feeling. Its actually true, you are the words you say, unfortunately, you have to have facts and efforts to back it up.

            I’m not sure what you mean. But anyway, I feel like this is winding down, as discussions go. I hear a lot of you saying, “Look, I’m apolitical, this stuff doesn’t matter to me,” and me saying, “But it should matter to you, for these reasons.” I think the reasons do matter, and should matter to you, but I doubt I’ll convince you of that. *shrug*

            Reply

            1. Dude, you just keep insulting me: I don’t know why Im talking about, its ignorant of me. Im just offering opinions to someone who also has similar experiences. I get it though, Intellectualism has a fair amount of bullying and slander to it. No need. I didn’t say Koreans aren’t doing it, but you said it’ll take a long time if ever before the Bg Business takes notice, so thats the drop in the pond. I have no interest in Ornithology either, but tons of people do. Does that make me ignorant or stupid? Anyway, now its personal directed at me. Im sure the beer is delicious, but I like my weak coffee.

               Someone is better or worse than me. I doesnt matter. I do whats best for me and mine. I dont need validation from people I dont know, and I think you dont either.

               Creative types can leave or stay in Korea. The most important thing is to be creative. I have made no comment on Koreas artistic scene, its not my concern, and it doesn’t affect me. Do I have to work to improve that if I have no stake in it? I do my creative efforts outside of Korea. People ask me sometimes, but ti doesnt have enjoyment for me. So thats that.

               The Japanese required women to be educated, I believe the famous 3/1 movement was a bunch of female students, wasn’t it? I guess I forgot that.

               Everybody knows Korean woman are the real drivers in society here. When you ignore girls and cater to boys, thats creates a desire/want to be as good as the boys. Girls here are cool for sure. But thats another thing.

               I have alot of opinions, but may not be as articulate as you. I appreciate your time, but for me. I dont debate with people. I dont care. If something happens to me, Ill take notice.

               I work here, my bosses like me, and ive done well for myself. Thats business. Ive done alot for myself and my loved ones. Ive given to charities and a tad of volunteering.

               The good thing about life is its not one correct answer, theres not one right way, and nothing is set in stone. You can enjoy your nice beer and Ill drink my weak espresso.

               Well all piss it out eventually, but wasnt it delicious?

               Taste is also perspective.

               Have a great day.

               Joe

            2. Joe,

               That’s funny, I’m trying hard to not insult you. I’m not bullying you: I’m just pointing out when I think you’re not being rigorous or sensible. To cry bullying is a cop-out: to respond to your second comment here, if you want to convince someone that something is irrelevant or negligible, “I don’t care about it” isn’t really a helpful argument either.

               Now you’ve defined “relevance” as “Big Business taking notice”. I suppose that’s not moving the goalposts since you never defined with “a drop in the pond” meant, but even so, it doesn’t help your argument: the main Korean brewing companies have taken notice of the craft brewing industry. Some of them have even launched a few pseudo-craft beers to try compete, and in the same market (in grocery stores). They’re about as likely to win out as the American megabrew industry’s pseudo-“Craft brew” offerings, which means, not very… but to reiterate the point, Big Business has taken note, and reacted defensively.

               I have no interest in Ornithology either, but tons of people do. Does that make me ignorant or stupid?

               Of course not. But to denigrate ornithology as a “drop in the pond” would make you look ignorant or stupid. To claim that ornithologists have made no contributions to science would make you look both ignorant and stupid. (I have an ornithologist friend who would likely cluehammer you if you said such a thing.)

               Someone is better or worse than me. I doesnt matter. I do whats best for me and mine. I dont need validation from people I dont know, and I think you dont either.

               But you miss the point that the issues I mention are not something people engage with for validation. They’re things people engage with because they feel a moral responsibility to make the world a better place… and because they believe the world can be made a better place. They realize that they themselves benefit from the many efforts of others before them who have worked to do the same.

               (And if you’ve ever gotten medical treatment, or enjoyed a weekend off work, or voted in any election, or been free from feudal serfdom, or traveled using the miracle of flight, then you, too, have benefited from the–often uncompensated–work of others. We didn’t just “get” democracy, or modern medicine, or weekends, or flight: many, many people shed sweat, blood, tears, and even their lives for those benefits that you and I both enjoy. To not give back somehow, in some way, seems crass and selfish to me. Does it not strike you as crass and selfish? Especially considering that if we don’t keep moving forward, we are very likely to slide backward?)

               Creative types can leave or stay in Korea. The most important thing is to be creative. I have made no comment on Koreas artistic scene, its not my concern, and it doesn’t affect me. Do I have to work to improve that if I have no stake in it? I do my creative efforts outside of Korea. People ask me sometimes, but ti doesnt have enjoyment for me. So thats that.

               Sigh. Creative types can leave or stay, it’s true. But it’s also pretty shameful that Korea’s arts scene is less developed, vibrant, and widespread than the arts scene in a developing nation like Indonesia. Seriously: Indonesia is decades ahead of Korea in terms of its arts scene. They host a world class jazz fest, you can see excellent jazz pretty often, they have art displays everywhere (including frigging shopping malls). The reasons for this are complex, and part of it is that the rich in Indonesia have been rich longer, and are less nouveau-riche than rich Koreans; but it’s also because, especially after 1997, the support of the arts and creative fields basically got pulled out from under everyone like a rug. That’s the metaphor one author I read used to describe it: it was like, if it doesn’t make money, it’s garbage.

               Which leaves Korea with, what? Basically, a crippled literary scene. Basically, a purely commercialized film scene. Basically, a corporate-dominated music scene. Most college kids never see a single live band. They never see a single art movie. Many actively despise Korean literature. As the screenwriting guru Robert McKee put it:

               Storytelling is the primary civilizing instrument in culture. ‘When the storytelling goes bad in society, the result is decadence.’ The way out is through great storytelling. It sensitizes society to the humanity in other people. Writers of the 21st Century will have to work harder. They can’t sell out. And if they don’t sell out, they’ll have the potential to do something of beauty and value.

               And while maybe you don’t care about storytelling too, I think it matters a great deal. I think McKee is right. I see the proof of it in the students I meet, who are unable to create stories with characters motivated by anything but money… and unable to motivate themselves to do anything except through money. It makes for a sick value system, and that’s a problem for everyone. And the loss of creatives–the effective brain-drain of creatives–is a horror show for Korean society. Not for the creatives, who, if they work hard, can succeed elsewhere. But that’s the dynamic we see in Korea: all the creative people seem eager to leave, so what you get left with is the uncreatives. Korea’s best political filmmaker, Bong Joon-Ho, lives in New York City. That’s a warning sign of a problem right there in and of itself.

               The Japanese required women to be educated, I believe the famous 3/1 movement was a bunch of female students, wasn’t it? I guess I forgot that.

               Yes, and like in any colonial situation, some women did better for themselves under the occupation than they were prior to it. Which is not to call occupation a boon. Doubtless feminist agitation did have something to do with it. (I’m not sure about how feminist 3/1 was: I’m not up to speed on all that.)

               Everybody knows Korean woman are the real drivers in society here. When you ignore girls and cater to boys, thats creates a desire/want to be as good as the boys. Girls here are cool for sure. But thats another thing.

               That’s interesting, but I’m leery about equating the lower status with the drive to succeed. I think it’s more like the boys are spoiled and pampered as children, have more given to them on silver platters, and develop a sense of entitlement that girls don’t develop. There’s a family whose daughters we teach mentioned in the above post, whose resource allocation is very telling: two teen girls go to Korean International high school. The little elementary school boy goes to International School. It costs a certain amount per kid, and if it were my wife and me doing the triage, we’d be immersing one of the daughters first since the detriments of Korean elementary school are much less than the detriments of Korean middle and high schooling. But the family automatically deems it necessary for the boy to get the best of everything. Maybe you’re right that catering to the boys helps instill a drive in women, but I don’t perceive that so much in the women I’ve taught. What I perceive is just the same sense most boys have of being compelled from the outside to learn, but without the entitlement that so many boys seem to develop.

               I have alot of opinions, but may not be as articulate as you. I appreciate your time, but for me. I dont debate with people. I dont care. If something happens to me, Ill take notice.

               I work here, my bosses like me, and ive done well for myself. Thats business. Ive done alot for myself and my loved ones. Ive given to charities and a tad of volunteering.

               Which is the thing: I don’t think we’re making headway because you’re insistent that the personal is the only political worth taking very seriously. I think that “the personal is political” doesn’t exclude the politics of things that transcend personal experience. And maybe that’s the root of my frustration here: your attitude isn’t particularly unusual at all: it’s a very common, very normal attitude to say, political stuff? Meh, that’s not my issue… it doesn’t affect me, why should I care?

               The best argument I’ve seen against it is the three-part documentary by Adam Curtis titled The Century of the Self. I highly recommend it if you’d like more insight into that. But you’ve advertised loudly and clearl that you’re not interested in debate… which reads as, “I’m not interested in hearing why I ought to be interested.” I’ve spent lots of time trying to explain why you should, but it can’t be completely up to me to change your mind… especially if you don’t want to change it.

               Then again, you do keep coming back. So maybe there’s something in the back of your mind niggling at you, suggesting maybe I do have a point. Maybe you should try the Morris documentary. It’s long, but one of the best on the subject of the depoliticization of the West. Basically, how you start with people aware of and committed to protecting and expanding their rights (when those rights were constantly abused) and end up, a century later, with a bunch of people who talk about how they were nice to their families and loved ones as if it deserves a pat on the back; how they do fine economically, and maybe donate a little money and volunteer a little, and shouldn’t that be enough? And meanwhile, the corporations consolidate power, the governments strip away rights, and most people don’t seem to see that this would be an issue.

               You may disagree with me. I would say you may need to fill in some of the blanks you aren’t aware are there. If you’re truly interested in continuing the discussion, please go check out the Curtis and then we can continue. We’ll have a little more common ground, referentially speaking. Okay?

               Which, if you think I’m insulting you: I think it’s the conundrum we’re ALL mired in. Me too. You may have donated more to charities, and volunteered, more than I have, in fact. You may have done more for your family, too. I don’t know. Far be it from me to castigate you for not giving a shit about a lot of things. But it feels hard not to see such a claim in a context, one in which the prime beneficiaries are, well, the interests and individuals that history will see as the bad guys.

               By the way, I like espresso, too, though not weak espresso. (Can’t see the point in weak espresso!)

8. If you want to convince someone of a cause, you have to show them how it relates to them, not just what its doing. Thats sympathy. You need empathy to motivate / inspire mostly, I think.

   Reply

   1. Figured I’d just address this, as it’s classic internet idiocy: lecturing that you have to demonstrate personal relevance to someone who is deeply committed to deeming everything personally irrelevant is basically just saying: I don’t care, make me care… nope, still don’t care, make me care.

      It’s one thing to ask, “But what has this to do with me?” and then listen. It’s another to say, “But I don’t really care!” as if it’s a response. It’s a reply, but it’s not a response.

      For those who are following this thread, though, I’ve posted two more parts to finish it out.

      Reply

9. Dude, where you intend to or not, you come across as condescending to me, when all I have been doing is stating my opinion, on this open public forum. Like I said before, I know theres a big element of bullying and snobbery to intellectualism, thats cool, but I did like the one “If I was TRULY intelligent, I would….” Me and my false intelligence. :) Also, your Orthinologist friend would clawhammer me? Im expressing my opinions, and you come back with a threat. I would say, thats not the way to debate. But I digress.

   Which of the 9 varieties of intelligence is lacking I wonder..

   Your talk of the craft brewing reminds me of the kinds of NETs we get nowadays. A bit High-Filuting for my tastes. Everyone climbing over each other, for what I feel is very little return. Everyone fights to live in Seoul (or Busan to be fair). Different strokes.

   I don’t care about it is a fine answer. Its not my bag. I don’t like jazz I like rock. Is that bad? I get off on Zeppelin much more than Miles Davis. Thats enough for me. Why does they’re need to be more?

   Isn’t life about picking and choosing? Theres only one way?

   Making the world a better place? As a teacher, I think I do that enough. Who’s to say I don’t? Not everyone in this game is a wild 20y/o or a beer connoisseur. There are others here. I reiterate, gay rights? migrant rights? What does it have to do with me? Now, immigration reform in the US, Id support, but its about 20 years too late, but Ill vote for that.. That means something to me.

   I come back because you’re nice enough to write a good response, but Im tired too now. Of course when someone says its irrelevant, it means irrelevant to me personally, unless otherwise stated. Thank you for the suggestion, but I don’t like movies per se. I prefer to get my heavy mental baggage from other avenues.

   Brain Drain happens in most conservative environments. Even my own art, I flog it outside of Korea, but I wouldn’t say if an artist “works hard” they’ll succeed, thats a small part of it. Thats a danger nowadays, i think people relegate arts to method rather than experience birthing methods. Quincy Jones said “music was waiting for God to walk into the room.”

   Theres tons of bands in Korea, even elementary kids are learning bass and drumming in hagwons now. Hongdae is full of all kinds of bands and venues now for music. Now, are they special, worth your time? Thats for you to say.

   And last of all:

   To not give back somehow, in some way, seems crass and selfish to me. Does it not strike you as crass and selfish? Especially considering that if we don’t keep moving forward, we are very likely to slide backward?)
   How do you know Im not moving forward? What is your yardstick for progression? Just because Im not into the causes of the day (pot, migrants, gay, beer) means very little in the scheme of my everyday existence. Im not here to win friends and influence people, Im here to live. You shrugged in your last signoff and now you look come off as uppity again “I would Never drink weak espresso.” IF you don’t think you do, thats ok. This your blog and you can say what you want as you want.
   Selfish? Im very selfish? Why is that bad, its what I am right now. Im not cheap, or stingy, but for my own reasons, Im selfish. You have a blue sweater, I have a red.

   Just saying man. You can respond or not, but this is my last writing. I hope you wont drop a little quip at me in the end though. I feel its not good in the spirit of idea exchange. Its not a battle, I think.

   Reply

   1. Joe,

      Dude, where you intend to or not, you come across as condescending to me, when all I have been doing is stating my opinion, on this open public forum.

      The problem with comments like that is that, I’ve learned in my life, you can be as nice and respectful as possible, and someone will always take refuge in “You’re so condescending!” at some point. I’ve tried hard to rein it back, but it’s hard when someone states something that’s factually wrong as his opinion, then redefines what he meant, then dismisses evidence that what he’s still claiming is wrong. My experience is, when you point out that someone’s overstating his case, has his facts wrong, or is constantly claiming that it’s all just opinion (as you seem to like to do) then offering any contrary evidence in a well-written way is going to bring criticisms of snobbery, elitism, condescension. In other words, are you sure I’m being condescending? You’re the one who keeps apologizing for his lack of eloquence; it seems to be your hangup, not mine.

      My ornithologist would cluehammer you, I said. Maybe you don’t spend much time online: cluehammer means would rebut you with facts so forcefully that your “opinion” would be revealed as uninformed. It’s not a threat: hell, even if I’d said “clawhammer” it wouldn’t be a threat: clawhammer is an engaging banjo playing style, so presumably being clawhammered would mean being serenaded with a banjo. Not such a horrible threat.

      By the way: the reference to “truly intelligent” is clearly a reference back up to our discussion of what’s valued in Korean education. (Cleverness versus intelligence. You describe the way you operate in Korea in a way that first directly with the idea of “clever” defined in that discussion.) But yes, to be clear: I do think it’s more intelligent to see the connections between things, the wide-ranging implications of them all.

      Your talk of the craft brewing reminds me of the kinds of NETs we get nowadays. A bit High-Filuting for my tastes. Everyone climbing over each other, for what I feel is very little return.

      Now I understand your misconception. You’re using money as a standard, and you’re talking about everyone climbing over everyone else [to make a buck], something I agree does happen in Seoul. I am personally baffled by the enmities that have emerged in the craft beer scene: where everyone could and ought to be cooperating since there’s a vast untapped market for good beer in the country, I see a lot of rage and enmity and turf warfare.

      But I’m not talking about craft beer bars. I’m talking about homebrewers: I’m talking about people like me who made beer in their homes, and shared it with people at festivals; who taught people–including lots of Koreans–how to make beer; who introduced new beer styles into the national repertory and range of tastes. Most of them made no money, and in fact gave it generously; brewed for fundraisers; taught for the love of the hobby; and shared information and resources just for the joy of sharing. That’s not people climbing all over one another. It’s grassroots, and positive.

      (Unlike the climbing all over one another, which, while there are good returns for a few people, I’m not crazy about. I know people who are constantly trying to think of a way to make a buck off the hobby, even to the detriment of the growth of the hobby itself. It turns me off: not the making a buck, the detriment part.)

      My point is: it’s fine to like what you like and not like what you don’t like. It’s not fine to dismiss others passions, or to dismiss that by sharing and contributing to the spread of their passions, they change the world. That’s my primary beef with you in this whole discussion.

      You keep saying, “I don’t like beer, I like coffee.” That’s fine. It’s also utterly tangential to what I was correcting you on: my point is that homebrewers–including foreign ones–have helped change the face of beer in Korea, and are still doing it. A lot. That’s a fact whether you like beer or not, and not liking beer is not evidence that it’s not true.

      I don’t care about it is a fine answer. Its not my bag. I don’t like jazz I like rock. Is that bad? I get off on Zeppelin much more than Miles Davis. Thats enough for me. Why does they’re need to be more?

      Isn’t life about picking and choosing? Theres only one way?

      Again, this is a typical simplification, and has been typical for ages. John Locke complained that Christians in his day were prone to believing they would inevitably have been Christians no matter what, even though they obviously would ahve been Muslism or Buddhists if born in the places where those religions dominated.

      What you’re ignoring–and it’s a particularly American blinkering–is that individual choice is not shaped or constrained by anything outside the individual. For example, “People [always] eat unhealthy food by choice.” Google the term “food desert” and you’ll learn that in some poorer neighborhoods, people with the least access to transportation are stuck in regions where there aren’t really many better choices available. Choice in the capitalist culture is central to the mythology of capitalism, a kind of mythic liberation that in reality is heavily constrained. Choice is always constrained, usually as invisibly as possible. Central to the mechanics of power is the benefits to corporations and elites that comes from more effectively erasing the vast majority of choices that exist, constraining apparent choices to fit the range of services of products available.

      (The simple example being the woman I worked with who said, “I love all kinds of music: rock, country, and rap.” Her musical tastes are not the issue. The blinders that have invisibly convinced a woman woman living in a world with a million different kinds of music, and immediate access to them, not realizing that they exist, or that she might enjoy some of them, is part of that mechanics of power. It is, in other words, cultural impoverishment, and worse, it’s cultural impoverishment that she doesn’t even realize.)

      But the music thing is a tangent I’ve discussed elsewhere. The example is only to say: your assessment of choice and agency is too simplistic. Agency and choice are always constrained by institutions with power, and the constraints they exert are usually not for our benefit… because, effectively, they don’t just blind us to those other possibilities, they effectively erase them.

      The case of indie rock in Korea is a great example: you’re right that kids do learn bass and drums in hakwons, and have for a long time. But the live music scene in Korea is heavily constrained, and integral to that is companies who want people to think of music as something that is experienced online, or in the form of downloaded MP3s, or some other form that they profit from. There’s a nice little indie scene, yes, but they’re losing the cultural war in ways that are mind-blowing for a musician from the West. I lived in a city the size of Iksan, but most people I know in college saw at least a few live bands a year. Live music was part of our culture. And there’s strong, strong reasons for why live music is integral to the vitality of an artistic culture of society–even live rock music shows.

      That may not matter to you personally. But I distrust the idea that it doesn’t matter to you because it’s not important. I would argue that part of the mechanism of ensuring our horizons are constrained involves convincing vast numbers of people that the constraints, when they do become apparent, don’t seem all that relevant. See, this is the thing: you seem to see the individual human being in the conventional way, as a mass of personal, individual, autonomous impulses, tastes, preferences, and decisions. I see us otherwise, and I think there’s politics involved in all the forces that shape us… and that the forces that shape us in terms of, say, musical taste or literature, and our attitudes towards things like race or the status of women, are intricately linked. And fundamentally it all links to power and its concrete analog, money.

      To not give back somehow, in some way, seems crass and selfish to me. Does it not strike you as crass and selfish? Especially considering that if we don’t keep moving forward, we are very likely to slide backward?)

      How do you know Im not moving forward? What is your yardstick for progression? Just because Im not into the causes of the day (pot, migrants, gay, beer) means very little in the scheme of my everyday existence. Im not here to win friends and influence people, Im here to live.

      See, this is my point: you’re kind of blinded to the idea that anything beyond your own personal life, interests, and needs matters. I’m sure you perceive yourself as moving forward, processing, and so on. But you’ve time and again defined “living” as basically a self-centered, wholly autonomous thing. I don’t think that way, and I’ve been arguing against it, and at every step you’ve missed my point that it’s too simplistic, and, yes, I’ll say it’s intellectually and morally lazy. It’s the thing that most imperils everything good in the world today… and it’s a lack of that laziness and simplistic thinking that has, at every step in history, reduced the evils that human beings have had to suffer, and increased our collective and individual joys and liberties and blessings. At every step in history.

      You see, I’m talking about the deep structural effects of education (in the post above), and you’re saying, “It doesn’t affect me personally, why should I give a shit?” Well: you’re part of the system. Ultimately, you’re an agent of that system. Sure, you make bank on it, you profit personally, it makes your life nice and comfy. But you’re a cog in a system–we all are–and you’re specifically a cog in a system that shapes how young Koreans grow up and turn out, and the kind of society they create around them. You can be a passive cog in the system, or you can actively reflect on it, and think about your role, your effect, and whether you can use that role for good or for ill, in some way beyond teaching politeness and respect. In some way that makes possible a little more of that individual liberty that you believe is so integral to your own life, but which, if you teach in Korea, you’ve surely noticed many Koreans don’t experience. But to get there, you need to think harder than just, “It doesn’t matter to me.”

      Besides, I mentioned gay rights, migrant workers’ rights, and women’s rights in response to your question, “What would I protest?” My point wasn’t, “Go protest these things,” it was, “There are all kinds of things that need work. Plenty, though you seem to think there are none that matter.”

      As for the weak espresso, it was a weak attempt at a joke. I was trying to be nice: I’m addicted to over-strong coffee. That’s all I was saying. Again: I think maybe you’re projecting your own insecurities a bit here.

      But this, I can’t let pass:

      Selfish? Im very selfish? Why is that bad, its what I am right now. Im not cheap, or stingy, but for my own reasons, Im selfish. You have a blue sweater, I have a red.

      This is why America is in decline: the failure within the nation to grasp that there are problems that no celebration of individual choice and agency can solve; that there are problems that require solidarity. That enlightened self-interest doesn’t get us to a better, saner, more decent, or more sustainable world… it’s easier not to give a shit about those things, and you’re free to. But that’s precisely the kind of mindset that has led us to the environmental precipice on this planet, and I will be spending the rest of my life fighting that mindset. You can complain that I’m insulting you, but what I’m really doing is the same thing that those little metal fish hanging from the bells of Korean temples are supposed to remind you do: to wake people up from a sleep they don’t realize they’re trapped in.

      Anyway, thanks for the conversation, though I am glad it’s done… I have other things to do.

      Reply

10. But what I’m really doing is the same thing that those little metal fish hanging from the bells of Korean temples are supposed to remind you do: to wake people up from a sleep they don’t realize they’re trapped in.

    thnk y, sprmn. pprct yr svng m. Nc qp t th nd.

    h, nd hv wk hrt, s drnk wk cff, bt lv th tst f t nd dnt wnt t gv t p.

    gdspd, jhn glnn, p n th strtsphr, lkng dwn.

    stll dnt cr.

    Reply

    1. J-Soup:

       Yeah, I’ve been as patient as I can, but your last comment (which I’m leaving unpublished) crossed the line into trolling. You may wish to reflect on my Comment/Site Policy.

       Frankly, you’re playing the “tone argument” game, with a side order of psychological projecting (ie. weird hangups about intellectuals thinking they’re better than you). You’re pretending that if only I just said everything I’m saying in a more inoffensive way, you’d engage with the ideas… and then twisting what I say (even after clarification) in order to make it possible to sustain your pained protestations.

       It’s a load of bullshit: an arrogantly stated argument is just as easily refuted as a politely stated one, if it’s wrong. Since you can’t actually refute my arguments (and don’t care enough to bother to try), you focus instead on the following two things: (1) complaining about perceived tone (even after I explain than I was trying to make a joke), and (2) repeatedly chanting the one thing you are: “still dont care”… which is the equivalent of this:

       

       I get it. You’d rather not think about these things. Why go around reading blog posts about education and its problems, and how to make it better? Why keep coming back here and commenting, only to insist on telling me you don’t care? It’s not apparent to me, at this point, why you even read the original post at all… and, frankly, given the pathetic course this conversation took, I’m tempted to just delete the whole discussion that followed…

       There’s a huge internet out there, full of people who’re just as self-satisfied living with the same ideological blinders on. And they’ll publish your trolling comments. But I won’t.

       Reply

11. Great piece, Gord. I think that the issue of lack of ‘playtime’ is especially relevant. It seems to me that these kids are having their childhood stolen from them, with the result that they never really grow up. I think that this is a contributory factor to some Koreans’ inability to discuss issues that seem important to us (Westerners). This is not to say that all adult Koreans can be described this way – I’ve had many friends who were perfectly capable of arguing me ‘under the table’ – but the number who are simply unable to talk about workplace issues, and resort to either childish tantrums or silence, is disconcertingly large.

    Looking forward to the next installment!

    Reply

    1. Thanks Heather! Long time no see!

       I, too, think the lack of playtime is important. What’s more shocking to me is that the parents who are doing this did not have to endure these kinds of conditions themselves: for the generation who is parenting now, schooling to the degree it’s now carried out was not the norm. Kids were hakwonized, but not for four or more hours a day, like so many kids today.

       As for playtime, I think the problem is that kind of puritanical dismissal of play, imagination and so on that is common with most convention Korean adults. It’s tragic because play and imagination are integral, not only to creative arts, but also to the kinds of creative skillsets on which the Korean economy and Korean society are growing increasingly dependent, as their economy gets more open to the global market. (Meaning, knockoffs of nice foreign things are not going to be feasible forever.)

       As for being unable to talk about workplace issues: I think there’s probably more to it than that. Like, fundamentally different sense of where the boundaries of propriety are, and so on. It’s funny, I was explaining to a Korean student of mine this week that sometimes, the perceptions of boundaries are just opposite: in that, I found my Korean co-workers were willing to be very frank about things then they thought it was a minor issue, or irrelevant (criticizing my haircut or clothing) but tended to avoid serious discussions about workplace issues (never discussing student feedback or performing any kind of formal work performance assessments).

       My student nodded, saying this seemed normal to her; then I explained how, in the West, that seems backwards: you expect your employer to be frank with you about the important stuff–like, whether you’re doing a good job–because it affects the functioning of the company, and because if you know what you’re doing “wrong” then you can rectify it. But we expect people to be polite–to keep their opinions to themselves–when it comes to the minor stuff, like his or her opinion of your haircut or shoes, because that’s both personal and, in most cases, irrelevant.

       Which makes the widespread Korean stereotype of Japanese people being “two-faced” amusing. When you ask, “What do you mean?” the explanation usually involves a scenario where a Japanese person, asked about some irrelevancy like a haircut or shoes or clothing, keeps any negative opinion to himself or herself, but then comments later, in private, about it, to someone closer to them. As my wife said, “For the rest of the world, that’s just called good manners.”

       (Note:I don’t know about workplace feedback in Japan. I don’t know if they do a lot of formal performance reviews in Korean offices, either, for that matter, though the people I’ve asked have mostly said, “Not much.”)

       In other words, the boundaries, in other words, are drawn in different places in different cultures. Which is not to say the drawing of the lines is value neutral: I’ve noticed that women and minorities get a lot more blunt, appearance-based criticism, for one thing. I’ve also noticed a pattern where a lower-ranking professor will have a very good idea of how senior male colleagues think of her hair, her weight, or her clothing, but has no idea how she ranks in terms of workplace performance. The lack of proper formal work performance reviews in every educational institution I’ve worked in, in Korea, was quite stunning. It also facilitated a professor being fired on personal grounds, despite very positive student feedback.

       (In every case where a colleague of mine was “let go,” it was never made clear why the renewal wasn’t offered was done: in fact, it was almost always presented as an administrative decision from up above, when, in nearly every case, it was a decision made from within the department. An aversion to discussing workplace performance that profound has obvious implications for the quality of work people are doing… though there’s another can of worms to consider in terms of how quality the feedback would be, coming from someone who’s never gotten quality feedback himself. I worked with some direct supervisors I think could give great feedback, if they would just bother to; I’ve worked with others who were notoriously poor teachers themselves. *Shrug*)

       Reply

12. “I told them to look up azure, mauve, fuschia, taupe, emerald, jade… and then pointed out 99% of the time the word I heard people say in Korean was also the simplest. (빨간색, 초록색, etc.)”

    I actually asked my mother about this, and what she said was that she was my age, people commonly referred to things as “sky-colored” or “night-sky” / “navy” / “chestnut” / “jade”. And that IS how she and her friends talk. But I have also seen what you describe and so has my mother. She wonders if it’s not because people these days talk less, read less, and spend all their time texting. I’m inclined to agree. Not to split hairs, I just thought this was an interesting point you made.

    This post reminds me of a TV show I recently saw, trailing a “Gangnam mother” for a day, and the degree to which these women micromanage their children’s lives is truly suffocating, not only for the children, but the mothers themselves. It’s true that these women sacrifice a great deal, but in truth, it would be more accurate to say they suffer for the sake of their ambitions, or their fears, rather than the actual good of their children.

    Since I’ve heard some inklings from you about what the next post is going to be about, I’m just going to say this: the mother the program developers trailed admitted to being “terrified” of everyone calling her a “failure” as a mother if her child didn’t make it to a good college… even of divorce, because that “everyone” would include her husband (probably not the less because his needs have been totally ignored in this whole process of grooming the child). She admitted she barely had the strength to keep going, but she felt that if she collapsed, everything would collapse with her. That’s not a healthy attitude to take towards a nearly grown child, really. And I do think these women know it… if not their own failings, then at least they express desperation at how passive their children are, how hard it is to motivate them to keep going when motivation does not come from within. It’s a classic “they made their bed, they’re sleeping in it” case of bad parenting, I guess, but I think Korean parents could be ready for a change, if they had more confidence in themselves.

    Yeah, and sure you’re not like other foreigners I’ve met. I think that has everything to do with your attitude, though, which more expats than not seem to lack. I appreciate the thoughtful and respectful things you’ve written about this society, and hope you won’t fall into the pattern of blaming, apathy, and arrogance quite a few expats seem to follow. *ahem*

    Reply

    1. Hi Anne!

       “I told them to look up azure, mauve, fuschia, taupe, emerald, jade… and then pointed out 99% of the time the word I heard people say in Korean was also the simplest. (빨간색, 초록색, etc.)”

       I actually asked my mother about this, and what she said was that she was my age, people commonly referred to things as “sky-colored” or “night-sky” / “navy” / “chestnut” / “jade”. And that IS how she and her friends talk. But I have also seen what you describe and so has my mother. She wonders if it’s not because people these days talk less, read less, and spend all their time texting. I’m inclined to agree. Not to split hairs, I just thought this was an interesting point you made.

       Yeah, that sounds believable to me. As I say: most of the kids I meet who are schooled in the Korean “International” system are like the college students I remember: basically, the vast majority profess to hate reading. (A few don’t. But even they are sick and fucking tired of having their mothers dictate to them their reading materials.) Anyway, I’d buy that people used more involved and–as one of my old-hand friends who spoke way better Korean than I put it–“flowery” language in the past. A bit of that survives, I run across it sometimes.

       (Sadly, just as many Westerners seem happy with the basic palette of colors I learned in color-by-numbers coloring books as a kid. I learned words like “mauve” and “taupe” from the 1st Edition AD&D Dungeon Master’s Guide, truth be told:

       

       I think those kinds of color words have been on the wane for a long time in English…)

       Come to think of it, I have much more trouble talking to my mother-in-law, who used to always reflexively use the “hard” (ie. complicated, archaic, or “flowery”) way to say something to me, than I’ve ever had talking to younger people in Korean. (Though these days I’m so rusty it’s pathetic.)

       By the way, I have no problem with someone saying that Korean has “more complex” language rules for color–which, apparently, it does. The verb/adjective/noun forms differ enough to make it hard for me not to sound like a little kid. But the prof I mentioned actually was claiming it was an example of Korean being “superior.” Which… I dunno. There’s plenty of words in English that have verb/noun/adjective/adverb forms, but I don’t seem them necessarily being of “added value”; it’s just an artifact of language. Anglophones have no greater trouble describing colors in detail if they are so inclined. “Superior” is a word that usually smacks of inferiority complex and overcompensation, I guess, is what I’d say…

       This post reminds me of a TV show I recently saw, trailing a “Gangnam mother” for a day, and the degree to which these women micromanage their children’s lives is truly suffocating, not only for the children, but the mothers themselves. It’s true that these women sacrifice a great deal, but in truth, it would be more accurate to say they suffer for the sake of their ambitions, or their fears, rather than the actual good of their children.

       Since I’ve heard some inklings from you about what the next post is going to be about, I’m just going to say this: the mother the program developers trailed admitted to being “terrified” of everyone calling her a “failure” as a mother if her child didn’t make it to a good college… even of divorce, because that “everyone” would include her husband (probably not the less because his needs have been totally ignored in this whole process of grooming the child). She admitted she barely had the strength to keep going, but she felt that if she collapsed, everything would collapse with her. That’s not a healthy attitude to take towards a nearly grown child, really. And I do think these women know it… if not their own failings, then at least they express desperation at how passive their children are, how hard it is to motivate them to keep going when motivation does not come from within. It’s a classic “they made their bed, they’re sleeping in it” case of bad parenting, I guess, but I think Korean parents could be ready for a change, if they had more confidence in themselves.

       I’d be really interested in seeing that show, though I also feel like I’d want to throw our TV out the window. And it’s not even our TV! :)

       The crazy thing is that so many people go along with it, despite their own stress and weariness–and yeah, I’ve noticed the toll it takes on moms, too. Some don’t, mind you; there are people who swim against the current, and there’s no knowing how many. They certainly seem a minority among the Korean moms we’ve met here. One of them seems to have found an outlet for her energies by developing her own habits: she studies English with my wife, and puts serious energy and time into it, and lets her kids enjoy their childhood. (Her kids love to read. Connection? Who knows…) Another mom we know who doesn’t smother her kids is homeschooling them. I get the impression she’s busy with missionary work, which… well, at least her kids aren’t smothered. IT’s mostly like that: the moms who have a career, or interests and hobbies of their own seem less prone to the smothering.

       But another thing that’s struck is that, while it’s hard to convince them to stop smothering, it’s less hard to convince them that an alternate method could be beneficial to their kids, as long as you seem even remotely credible as an educator of some kind. When these moms bring their kids to us, they seem eager–or sometimes even desperate–to put a surprising amount of trust in us, though they only know us–at most–through recommendations, if even that. Moms who don’t know us from Adam and Eve end up asking us things like, “How much break-time and play-time should I allow my kid?” or, “When you say hobbies are good for kids… like, what kind?” or “Can you tell me a list of books I should get my kid?” and things like that. It’s like they (a) are eager to take practically anyone as an authority, like somehow someone else inevitably knows better than they themselves do–a lack of confidence that seems to be very exploited by the hakwon industry and its “experts”–and (b) have been trained to believe a one-size-fits-all approach is natural. Which is weird: when we interview kids, we always make it clear that we’re trying to suss out whether at all the kids and our approach are complementary… but they seem to presume it will be.

       Yeah, and sure you’re not like other foreigners I’ve met. I think that has everything to do with your attitude, though, which more expats than not seem to lack. I appreciate the thoughtful and respectful things you’ve written about this society, and hope you won’t fall into the pattern of blaming, apathy, and arrogance quite a few expats seem to follow. *ahem*

       Yeah, no kidding. (The blame, apathy, and arrogance.) It’s very hard, of course: I think for various reasons, it’s an easy trap to fall into. I’ve been recently reflecting on that, and will probably post eventually, but it’s a long, complex subject…

       As for me being “different”: aw, thanks. ;) But it’s different hearing that from someone who lived in North America for ages, right? It’s like, it means something when I say my wife is pretty far from the sociocultural norms or political mainstream of South Korea, because I’ve kinda picked up on those norms in the time I’ve been there. (It’s not like when some newbie says, “Wow, she’s not like Koreans at all!” because she doesn’t wear heels and makeup all the time, or something ignunt like that.)

       You say this because of differences you detect between me and actual people you know. Most of the time when I heard it, I was seen as surprising for diverging from stereotypical ideas of how foreigners act–I knew about Korean history (“Sure, I’ve heard of the 마한 Confederacy!”) or could eat Korean food (!) with chopsticks (!) or, you know, wasn’t some ridiculous over-the-top individualist, or wasn’t trying to seduce their sisters serially (or them, in the case of female friends).

       I actually never heard the “you’re not like other foreigners” from anyone who’d ever had prolonged or deep contact with non-Koreans.

       Reply

13. Another really great post, but I am a bit surprised you ended up expending so much effort in dealing with your troll. He lost all credibility as a supposed English teacher/trainer as soon as I saw that he has no clue about using apostrophes in writing.

    Reply

    1. Thanks John, for your comment and for mentioning the elephant in the room. (Given his penchant for whining about intellectual bullying, I figured I would wait for someone else to mention the English impairment.)

       Reply

14. Hi Gord. I just got done reading your original post. I was intrigued. Once I finish thinking a bit I’ll respond.

    I just wanted to say, “keep going.” Or should I say, ‘fighting!.

    Reply

    1. Roger,

       Thanks! I look forward to your response. I should be getting the follow-up post soon…

       Reply